For Women with ADHD ADD Who Want to Connect
Anyone heard of dyscalculia? I'm wondering if it's common in people with ADHD
Dyscalculia is a math disability but there are other characteristics of it that relate to time and distance. I definitely have dyscalculia and since I also have ADHD, I wondered if anyone else has heard of it, has it, or thinks they may have it based on the info below from Wikipedia -
"Overview:
Dyscalculia was originally identified in case studies of patients who suffered specific arithmetic disabilities as a result of damage to specific regions of the brain. Recent research suggests that dyscalculia can also occur developmentally, as a genetically-linked learning disability which affects a person's ability to understand, remember, or manipulate numbers or number facts (e.g., the multiplication tables). The term is often used to refer specifically to the inability to perform arithmetic operations, but it is also defined by some educational professionals and cognitive psychologists as a more fundamental inability to conceptualize numbers as abstract concepts of comparative quantities (a deficit in "number sense").[1] Those who argue for this more constrained definition of dyscalculia sometimes prefer to use the technical term Arithmetic Difficulties (AD) to refer to calculation and number memory deficits.
Dyscalculia is a lesser known disability, similar and potentially related to dyslexia and developmental dyspraxia. Dyscalculia occurs in people across the whole IQ range, and sufferers often, but not always, also have difficulties with time, measurement, and spatial reasoning.[citation needed] Current estimates suggest it may affect about 5% of the population. Although some researchers believe that dyscalculia necessarily implies mathematical reasoning difficulties as well as difficulties with arithmetic operations, there is evidence (especially from brain damaged patients) that arithmetic (e.g. calculation and number fact memory) and mathematical (abstract reasoning with numbers) abilities can be dissociated. That is (some researchers argue), an individual might suffer arithmetic difficulties (or dyscalculia), with no impairment of, or even giftedness in, abstract mathematical reasoning abilities.
The word dyscalculia comes from Greek and Latin which means: "counting badly". The prefix "dys" comes from Greek and means "badly". "Calculia" comes from the Latin "calculare". which means "to count". That word "calculare" again comes from "calculus", which means "pebble" or one of the counters on an abacus.
Dyscalculia can be detected at a young age and measures can be taken to ease the problems faced by younger students. The main problem is understanding the way mathematics is taught to children. In the way that dyslexia can be dealt with by using a slightly different approach to teaching, so can dyscalculia. However, dyscalculia is the lesser known of these learning disorders and so is often not recognized.
Potential symptoms:
Frequent difficulties with arithmetic, confusing the signs: +, −, ÷ and ×.
Difficulty with everyday tasks like checking change and reading analog clocks.
Inability to comprehend financial planning or budgeting, sometimes even at a basic level; for example, estimating the cost of the items in a shopping basket or balancing a checkbook.
Difficulty with multiplication-tables, and subtraction-tables, addition tables, division tables, mental arithmetic, etc.
May do fairly well in subjects such as science and geometry, which require logic rather than formulae, until a higher level requiring calculations is obtained.
Difficulty with conceptualizing time and judging the passing of time. May be chronically late.
Particularly problems with differentiating between left and right.
Difficulty navigating or mentally "turning" the map to face the current direction rather than the common North=Top usage.
Having particular difficulty mentally estimating the measurement of an object or distance (e.g., whether something is 10 or 20 feet (3 or 6 metres) away).
Often unable to grasp and remember mathematical concepts, rules, formulae, and sequences.
An inability to read a sequence of numbers, or transposing them when repeated, such as turning 56 into 65.
Difficulty keeping score during games.
Difficulty with games such as poker with more flexible rules for scoring.
Difficulty in activities requiring sequential processing, from the physical (such as dance steps) to the abstract (reading, writing and signaling things in the right order). May have trouble even with a calculator due to difficulties in the process of feeding in variables.
The condition may lead in extreme cases to a phobia or durable anxiety of mathematics and mathematic-numeric devices/coherences.
Low latent inhibition, i.e., over-sensitivity to noise, smell, light and the inability to tune out, filtering unwanted information or impressions. Might have a well-developed sense of imagination due to this (possibly as cognitive compensation to mathematical-numeric deficits).
Potential causes:
Scientists have yet to understand the causes of dyscalculia. They have been investigating in several domains.
Neurological: Dyscalculia has been associated with lesions to the supramarginal and angular gyri at the junction between the temporal and parietal lobes of the cerebral cortex.[2][3]
Deficits in working memory: Adams and Hitch[4] argue that working memory is a major factor in mental addition. From this base, Geary[5] conducted a study that suggested there was a working memory deficit for those who suffered from dyscalculia. However, working memory problems are confounded with general learning difficulties, thus Geary's findings may not be specific to dyscalculia but rather may reflect a greater learning deficit.
Other causes may be:
Short term memory being disturbed or reduced, making it difficult to remember calculations.
Congenital or hereditary disorders. Studies show indications of this, but the evidence is not yet concrete."
"Overview:
Dyscalculia was originally identified in case studies of patients who suffered specific arithmetic disabilities as a result of damage to specific regions of the brain. Recent research suggests that dyscalculia can also occur developmentally, as a genetically-linked learning disability which affects a person's ability to understand, remember, or manipulate numbers or number facts (e.g., the multiplication tables). The term is often used to refer specifically to the inability to perform arithmetic operations, but it is also defined by some educational professionals and cognitive psychologists as a more fundamental inability to conceptualize numbers as abstract concepts of comparative quantities (a deficit in "number sense").[1] Those who argue for this more constrained definition of dyscalculia sometimes prefer to use the technical term Arithmetic Difficulties (AD) to refer to calculation and number memory deficits.
Dyscalculia is a lesser known disability, similar and potentially related to dyslexia and developmental dyspraxia. Dyscalculia occurs in people across the whole IQ range, and sufferers often, but not always, also have difficulties with time, measurement, and spatial reasoning.[citation needed] Current estimates suggest it may affect about 5% of the population. Although some researchers believe that dyscalculia necessarily implies mathematical reasoning difficulties as well as difficulties with arithmetic operations, there is evidence (especially from brain damaged patients) that arithmetic (e.g. calculation and number fact memory) and mathematical (abstract reasoning with numbers) abilities can be dissociated. That is (some researchers argue), an individual might suffer arithmetic difficulties (or dyscalculia), with no impairment of, or even giftedness in, abstract mathematical reasoning abilities.
The word dyscalculia comes from Greek and Latin which means: "counting badly". The prefix "dys" comes from Greek and means "badly". "Calculia" comes from the Latin "calculare". which means "to count". That word "calculare" again comes from "calculus", which means "pebble" or one of the counters on an abacus.
Dyscalculia can be detected at a young age and measures can be taken to ease the problems faced by younger students. The main problem is understanding the way mathematics is taught to children. In the way that dyslexia can be dealt with by using a slightly different approach to teaching, so can dyscalculia. However, dyscalculia is the lesser known of these learning disorders and so is often not recognized.
Potential symptoms:
Frequent difficulties with arithmetic, confusing the signs: +, −, ÷ and ×.
Difficulty with everyday tasks like checking change and reading analog clocks.
Inability to comprehend financial planning or budgeting, sometimes even at a basic level; for example, estimating the cost of the items in a shopping basket or balancing a checkbook.
Difficulty with multiplication-tables, and subtraction-tables, addition tables, division tables, mental arithmetic, etc.
May do fairly well in subjects such as science and geometry, which require logic rather than formulae, until a higher level requiring calculations is obtained.
Difficulty with conceptualizing time and judging the passing of time. May be chronically late.
Particularly problems with differentiating between left and right.
Difficulty navigating or mentally "turning" the map to face the current direction rather than the common North=Top usage.
Having particular difficulty mentally estimating the measurement of an object or distance (e.g., whether something is 10 or 20 feet (3 or 6 metres) away).
Often unable to grasp and remember mathematical concepts, rules, formulae, and sequences.
An inability to read a sequence of numbers, or transposing them when repeated, such as turning 56 into 65.
Difficulty keeping score during games.
Difficulty with games such as poker with more flexible rules for scoring.
Difficulty in activities requiring sequential processing, from the physical (such as dance steps) to the abstract (reading, writing and signaling things in the right order). May have trouble even with a calculator due to difficulties in the process of feeding in variables.
The condition may lead in extreme cases to a phobia or durable anxiety of mathematics and mathematic-numeric devices/coherences.
Low latent inhibition, i.e., over-sensitivity to noise, smell, light and the inability to tune out, filtering unwanted information or impressions. Might have a well-developed sense of imagination due to this (possibly as cognitive compensation to mathematical-numeric deficits).
Potential causes:
Scientists have yet to understand the causes of dyscalculia. They have been investigating in several domains.
Neurological: Dyscalculia has been associated with lesions to the supramarginal and angular gyri at the junction between the temporal and parietal lobes of the cerebral cortex.[2][3]
Deficits in working memory: Adams and Hitch[4] argue that working memory is a major factor in mental addition. From this base, Geary[5] conducted a study that suggested there was a working memory deficit for those who suffered from dyscalculia. However, working memory problems are confounded with general learning difficulties, thus Geary's findings may not be specific to dyscalculia but rather may reflect a greater learning deficit.
Other causes may be:
Short term memory being disturbed or reduced, making it difficult to remember calculations.
Congenital or hereditary disorders. Studies show indications of this, but the evidence is not yet concrete."
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Nicki on -
Hmmm... I wonder if I have this! I don't usually mix up numbers, but I definitely have always had a horrid time learning anything related to math. I still can't stand checking analog clocks... especially if they use roman numerals or if they only have little dashes instead of numbers! I can't follow maps. It took me forever to learn the multiplication tables... I used to have to stay in at recess. And I still have to hold up my hands and look for the "L" made from my thumb and index finger, to tell left from right!
- Nicki
http://adhdangel.blogspot.com
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Permalink Reply by ADDSarah on
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There is some comorbidity (both conditions occurring) between learning disabilities (such as dyslexia, dyscalculia, etc.) and ADD/ADHD. I don't think I have dyscalculia per se, but I do have some problems with left/right, and with counting - for example, if someone asks me how many people were in a room, I have no idea unless I individually count them.
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Permalink Reply by Addy on -
I've was diagnosed with this at the same time as my ADHD diagnosis in college (it also turned out that I have motor dysgraphia, a handwriting disorder, which makes filling out paperwork a nightmare).
I basically can't do math at all. Additionally, like many dyscalculics, I had difficulty with sight-reading and music theory, I can't dance and am generally uncoordinated, and I suck at remembering the rules to games. Playing cards is right out. A lot of dyscalculics also have trouble with maps and directions, but for whatever reason this has never been a problem for me.
I wrote this article on the subject if anyone is interested. The Dyscalculia Forum is also a wonderful resource, and a great place to vent if you've had a bad math day.
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Permalink Reply by Kate on -
As I mentioned before, I'm a math tutor (high school, junior high). One of the other tutors I work with has this. The other has dyslexia, surprisingly. (And I'm ADHD... yes, our sessions can be loud and crazy, lol!)
I know I have kids who struggle with this. What *seems* to help is making something a routine. I have one kid I with ADHD (a couple, actually), but this one student *really* struggles with the basic concepts. His learning style is such that I do a problem 2 or 3 times on the board while he watches. Then I walk him through a problem, stopping to literally write out every step in his notes. Then we do 20-30 problems, all the while, following his "steps." :)
So if you have this problem, try taking it all the way back to the basics and doing things over and over again. And writing everything down. :) (I'm the person on the plane who has to look at her ticket for her seat number 75,849,623,986,397 times while walking down the aisle to my seat, lol. Don't be ashamed to write down the smallest things... it's better than forgetting, ya know? :)
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Permalink Reply by MaryJo Wagner on
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Yup. Dyscalculia from early childhood. It's a nuisance at best. A nightmare at worst. No dyslexia. Had the lowest math test score ever recorded on the GRE's (exam to get into graduate school) that was combined with a very high verbal score. The test people couldn't figure it out. Seemed simple enough to me--I don't understand arithmetic, much less math. But reading, writing, words, etc--now that's a whiz! LOL!
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Permalink Reply by Layla on -
I have dyscalculia :)
yes I think they are all related, in fact I'm sick of having to list THREE disabilites (dyslexia, dyscalculia and AHDH) when I think they're all part of the same thing! There are overlaps with other neurological disabilities as well, it's more like there's one disorder where you may or may not get all the symptoms. And dyscalculia dyslexia etc are symptoms of it rather than the actual disorder??? That's what I'm inclined to think anyway......
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Permalink Reply by Addy on
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Kate said:
"So if you have this problem, try taking it all the way back to the basics and doing things over and over again. And writing everything down. :) (I'm the person on the plane who has to look at her ticket for her seat number 75,849,623,986,397 times while walking down the aisle to my seat, lol. Don't be ashamed to write down the smallest things... it's better than forgetting, ya know? :)"
Hi Kate,
I can imagine taking things back to basics, repetition, et al. working for someone with just ADHD, but it never helped me in math. Many dyscalculics simply don't have an inner referent for numbers and what they mean. We also frequently have sequencing problems, so writing it down and repeating it a lot is actually a recipe for frustration at best.
My only mathematical success was at a Monessorri kindergarten that used math manipulatives. Since I could see, touch, and manipulate the tools, numbers and operations became much less abstract.
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Permalink Reply by Jenn on
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I stumbled upon the wikipedia post about a year ago, and felt so validated. I'm in my 30's and still don't know my multiplication tables (but I've got a system where I have parts of it memorized and add the difference by counting on my fingers), loved algebra, but was not very good in geometry and failed calculus once in high school and could never complete it in college (so I finally changed my major to one that didn't require it). Had trouble with a lot of math and time concepts as a young child until my father used "physical" aids such as pennies for showing multiplication. Can't give a distance estimate or understand one to save my life. Always pick the wrong size tupperware container for the food (clearly an estimating problem). And my favorite: always confuse the numbers 4 and 7. For example, if I am supposed to remember the number 54, I CANNOT remember if it is 54 or 57. This doesn't occur with the other numbers, just 4 and 7. Time is a foreign concept. Strangely, I really like math (like algebra and statistics) and deal with a lot of numbers at work. I wondered if this was strongly related to ADD. Wonder if anyone has studied this?
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